Barnaul ammo

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gmountain
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Barnaul ammo

Post by gmountain »

Is it any good? From what I've been able to find, it seems it's pretty hot, as far as 9x18 goes.
protector
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Barnaul ammo

Post by protector »

Barnaul makes Silver and Brown bear ammo,I personally like the silver bear myself.www.aimsurplus.com has it for $7.50 a box +shipping!!
Last edited by protector on November 3rd, 2007, 8:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Aim small,hit small...
protector
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Barnaul ammo

Post by protector »

UH OH THEIR OUT!!
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bzinggg
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Barnaul ammo

Post by bzinggg »

Maybe we'll get lucky and the next run of Silver Bear will be from the LVE (Low Voltage Electric) plant in Novosibirsk. It's a cut above the Silver Bear zinc cased 94gr we've been subjected to here lately. I got lots of both and shot lots of both and I think LVE makes it much better! Even the cartridge divider is better, being solid plastic instead of flimsey cardboard.
trent
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Barnaul ammo

Post by trent »

here's some silver bear, http://www.jandcsales.com/9x18.html
nbender
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Post by nbender »

I'm not sure why anyone would want Silver Bear to go back to the LVE plant. The Silver Bear made at LVE was so bad it had people swearing off of Makarovs, until they learned it was the ammo. LVE made some great 9x18: the old "Green Box" which was probably military ammo; but their 115 and 120-grain 9x18 JHP for Silver Bear was disastrous.

I had so many squibs with SB 115-grain that I learned to take a dowel and oil to the range and I would beat the bullets out of the barrel with my shoe. I got some looks doing that! Criticalbass threw all of his 115-grain Silver Bear down an abandoned well.

Others couldn't feed the 120-grain into magazines because the OAL was so out of spec.

The Barnaul factory has always enjoyed the best reputation in 9x18 for reliability and that's where I hope 9x18 continues to originate from. The problem is that all 9x18 is dumbed down these days to meet the requirements of the PA-63 and the general warnings about heavy loads in all 9x18 pistols.
Last edited by nbender on November 7th, 2007, 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
volfandan
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Barnaul ammo

Post by volfandan »

I've heard people swear that you can't shoot heavier than 95 gr. in PA-63's......and I've heard others say that the frames are tough enough to handle any 9x18 ammo made.

nbender, what do you honestly think?
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Post by nbender »

volfandan, I dunno, honestly. I don't have the personal experience of trying heavy loads in that pistol.

So I send you to this post:

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=4600

George at Makarov.com ran a gun shop for years. He makes a pretty compelling case against heavy loads through the PA-63. As I remember, he doesn't mention the all-steel frame P-64.
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Post by volfandan »

thanks for the link. I wonder if the old Norinco green box ammo is OK for the PA-63? I didn't see it mentioned in the list.
trent
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Post by trent »

I believe it is, itn't it like 92 grains?
nbender
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Post by nbender »

Norinco green box (the same thing is also sold as Jing An) is built to standard 9x18 specs so I don't think there would be a problem with shooting it in a PA-63. In fact, it seems ideal.
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beasleydano
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Post by beasleydano »

I shoot Norinco grren box and Jing An blue box in mine and have seen no ill effects.
ourbigbluehouse
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Barnaul ammo

Post by ourbigbluehouse »

Here's another of my dumb questions. How does the effectiveness ie stopping power of the lighter loads (92, 95) compare to the stronger 100gr ones? Is there any significant difference than a sore hand?
trent
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Post by trent »

In my highly un-professional opinion (meaning I'm guessing) that small of a difference probably doesn't matter too much, but say if you compare a 9x18 at 95 grains to a .45acp at 230 grains, there will be a conciderable difference in the ammount of mass that hits its target.

but how does one truly regulate stopping power in the first place? The whole concept of "stopping power" is full to the rim with different variables. (I really hope I don't start a forum war by saying this) ::)
Last edited by trent on November 9th, 2007, 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
bzinggg
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Post by bzinggg »

I'm not sure why anyone would want Silver Bear to go back to the LVE plant. The Silver Bear made at LVE was so bad it had people swearing off of Makarovs, until they learned it was the ammo. LVE made some great 9x18: the old "Green Box" which was probably military ammo; but their 115 and 120-grain 9x18 JHP for Silver Bear was disastrous.

I had so many squibs with SB 115-grain that I learned to take a dowel and oil to the range and I would beat the bullets out of the barrel with my shoe. I got some looks doing that! Criticalbass threw all of his 115-grain Silver Bear down an abandoned well.

Others couldn't feed the 120-grain into magazines because the OAL was so out of spec.

The Barnaul factory has always enjoyed the best reputation in 9x18 for reliability and that's where I hope 9x18 continues to originate from. The problem is that all 9x18 is dumbed down these days to meet the requirements of the PA-63 and the general warnings about heavy loads in all 9x18 pistols.
I think this is a bunch of bull. I've got two Makarovs, 5 P-64s, 2 Vz.82s and had one other Bulgarian Makarov and I have had no trouble firing LVE Silver Bear 115gr nickle case HPs out of any of them, other than the fact that two, and ONLY two, of the P-64 Magazines needed the corners of the lips polished back a tiny bit to feed properly. You'll just go to any length to put down anything I say, and that's not very professional for a person who insists on being an advisor or "ammo expert".

Now, I've left you alone for a couple of months, on here, but you never miss a chance to put me down or be unfriendly. You've got a real problem with your little ego, and I am tired of your pointed animosity. Once somebody wrinkles you a little bit, you can never get over it. You don't have any VALIDATION as an ammo expert. All you did was make a $10.00 donation and you come on like you own the place.
For all we know, you're just a "clip and paste artist" These forums are anonymous, and you get bent out of shape if anyone wants to know who the real person is to stand behind all you "professional" authority and recommendations.


The only technical expert I acknowledge is one who you can reach if something goes wrong. LIKE NORM. He is real. When he disagrees with me, or I with him, he doesn't feel like he has to put me down or make me look a fool. Around here, advice on ammo and firearms stops with Norm who accepts personal responsibility for his advice with his real name and phone number. EVERYBODY who won't should preface their remarks with "I think" or "it is my opinion, but I could be wrong", and they shouldn't jump on other posters, correcting them, which is what got you in trouble with me in the first place, months ago.

Now, before any of the rest of you come on here telling me to lay off, let me just tell you, I'm an American, and I believe in free speech. I post my experiences and opinions on here as just that, my experience, and my opinion. I don't and never have set myself up as some kind of expert or authority. I always say "I think", or my opinion is such and such.
If somebody starts singling me out and then persists and persists at it, I'm liable to give them a piece of my mind.
I tried to be friendly half a dozen times with you, nbender, but you're not so disposed.

I didn't take this to a PM because that over-the-top little speech of yours was posted in public, here, and it was plainly designed to try and make me look stupid. There's no denying that, and that is just plain unfriendly, and it's always been you who would not let anything go, not me. You want to attack somebody and plainly insinuate their opinion is the dumbest thing you have ever heard, and all your buddies dumped it down the well and BS and BS and BS, then you're going to get this back at you, publicly.

The last time this happened, somebody in your corner came on and said "Just shut up!" I was humble enough to do so. I stopped arguing at his request. YOU CAME BACK ON AND ADDED ANOTHER HATEFUL REMARK! Well, I'm telling you and everybody else here, that you were picking a fight with the tone of your post here, and you and they know it. If you do it publicly, I have the right, and obligation, out of self respect, to answer it publicly!

Now, I'm done and we're EVEN. If you come back on here with another derrogatory rermark toward me it will prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that you ARE THE PROBLEM. So, now, if you have any more remarks even remotely related to me or my posts, you go to a Private Message, and I will do the same.

Frank, (bZinggg)
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