Part 2: Concealed carry w/ one in tube?

volfandan · Post by **volfandan** » July 27th, 2007, 1:48 am

Great post! This begs another question. Most members responded that they carried "safety off, hot". My question to all of you who carry safety off, hot:

Have you replaced any springs (such as mainspring) to lighten the DA trigger pull? If so, is the trigger pull heavy enough after a spring mod that it still is safe to carry "safety off, hot"?

Thanks

pshootr · Post by **pshootr** » July 27th, 2007, 3:02 am

If you lighten the hammer spring you MAY be able to get the double-action trigger pull about equal to that of a factory stock S&W "J" Frame revolver. Otherwise, the stock P-64 double-action trigger pull is quite a bit heavier. My concern would be the very light single-action pull that results.

devlinfaust · Post by **devlinfaust** » July 27th, 2007, 7:46 am

volfandan,

Funny you should mention that. I have to P-64's. One one of them I did the Wollf spring thing which lreduced the felt recoil some and ightened the trigger pull. This is on the 'carry' gun. My spring gauge only goes up to about 8 pounds, so I can't say for sure, but I would guess that it lowered the trigger pull (and this is only a guess) from about 22 pounds down to about 15 or 16 pounds. I still feel that it's perfectly safe to be loaded, safety off, and would agree that the DA pull is now probably just a bit harder than most DA revolvers (out of the box).

With the other P-64, I just did the mainspring thing for the recoil, but not the DA trigger. This one is not to carry but stays at a certain room and would be drawn if necessary. I reasoned (probably not very well) that if someone were to pick this up somehow (as it is not always with me) that a novice might find the DA so hard that they would possibly think that the gun was malfunctioning and give up on it.

9x18shooter · Post by **9x18shooter** » July 27th, 2007, 8:03 am

My springs are all stock. I may at some time order some springs to try out. I did dry fire on a snap cap probably a few thousand rounds on each one and it either worked in the action or my finger got stronger. Not sure which one. ;D

Post by **dfunk** » July 27th, 2007, 8:22 am

Mine is 100% stock. Even with a trigger pull of 5 lbs., I would still do the same. ::cough::glock::cough::

Post by **papabear** » July 27th, 2007, 9:08 am

+1 with dickfunk,

I prefer the heavy DA pull, mine are stock also, only change I made were the grips. For me its all a matter of practice, practice and more practice and every time I go to the range I take my carry P-64 and practice pulling it either from my pocket holster, my clipdraw carry, or my IWB carry with one in the tube and safety off. For me the heavy DA pull is a "safety".

In a stress situation I don't feel I would have the time to draw my weapon and rack a round into the chamber or click of the safety or even take the time to cock the hammer to fire SA, although that is the way I use to do it before I practiced, now I simply draw and fire. I don't aim, I also practice "POINT SHOOTING", it cuts down on the time to fire. I would never draw my weapon to scare off or to intimidate someone to leave me alone, if I draw the weapon I intend to shoot to kill, no if's and's or but's. I've been there before and hope I never have to do that again.

papabear

beasleydano · Post by **beasleydano** » July 27th, 2007, 9:36 am

I concur. Mine are 100% stock. I tried different springs early on and went back to stock. Harder trigger pull but more reliable. No surprises. More confidence in the pistol. I am no gunsmith and don't have the patience for experimentation. More power to guys who make mods. It's just not for me.

rlj102468 · Post by **rlj102468** » July 27th, 2007, 9:54 am

I concider the lump on my neck to be my safety! I hope it serves me right. I have not had a chance to use it in a hostile enough situation to warrant pulling my pistol (THANK GOD).

himmel · Post by **himmel** » July 27th, 2007, 5:27 pm

Still with the consensus--my springs are the originals. Shooter, I think your finger got stronger, that's what happened to me--the trigger is very manageable for me now, but my daughter still can't budge it... LOL!

bzinggg · Post by **bzinggg** » July 27th, 2007, 6:20 pm

+1 Concur, all stock.

manicmechanic · Post by **manicmechanic** » July 28th, 2007, 10:55 am

I almost fit the bill here. I carry with one chambered, but with safety on. I don't have a problem with a tight safety/decocker lever. It was tight, even after initial clean out and relube.
After replacing the recoil spring with the 22lb. Wolff#53422 ,(and modding the ends flat to make it fit), I installed the supplied firing pin spring that came with the recoil spring. And as everyone that has done this found out, the safety/decocker assembly has to come out. You may as well clean this area up and polish out any marred areas now on the barrel of the safety, and the detente plunger, and be done with it, because for me anyhow, this is not an easily accomplished task of reassembly, let alone catching all flying parts on disassembly. Lever was quite manageable after this procedure, and for me anyways, not hard to put to muscle memory.
You have to practice with what ever you plan on carrying, not just fire ammo down range, but draw, in my case push lever up to fire, and proceed with either point and shoot, or aim and fire. As mentioned in a much earlier post, make sure your practice is as you carry, with one in chamber+ 6 in mag, or however your method is, one in chamber + 5 in mag ect... This is to insure proper magazine feed and pistol function.
I also replaced the hammer spring to the 20lb. rated Wolff# 34320 spring. It still is, I'm only guessing here, 15+ pounds to pull in DA, and surprisingly not much lighter of a SA pull than stock, which was fine for me all along. The DA was a different story. I had to rotate my grip around to be able to fire in DA, due to my short stubby fingers, and this was not acceptable to me. Lucky for me Wolff had just released the P-64 direct application springs, so I didn't have to fool around with all the other spring combos I had read about. But I did benefit from all the experiences of those that had, not just in their results, but in their how to do this mod posts, and pics.
Since doing these mods, I've never had any failures to feed, eject, chamber, or premature slide lock or magazine drop. I believe approximately 250 rounds have been fired since all of the changes were made.

blinddog · Post by **blinddog** » July 28th, 2007, 1:10 pm

I'm with the crowd on factory springs. I tried the spring change but did'nt really like it. I carry one in the tube off safety, I keep my safety off because if should something should happen I don't have to worry about remembering did I change from safety to fire mode. Does that make sense?

bzinggg · Post by **bzinggg** » July 28th, 2007, 3:52 pm

There's no advantage in speed, if you are well-practiced at knuckling the safety up as you raise the pistol to the ready position. If you always keep the safety on there is no confusion either. It aids in eleminating the possibility of shooting your kneecap off drawing or pulling the trigger early because of adrenalin hitting something or someone you didn't intend to shoot. If you are running or grappling with someone, it adds greater safety against accidental discharge from the gun dropping on the hammer or from AD if wrestling for control of the gun.

The likelyhood of your having to be a faster draw in a self-defense situation is close to nill, anyway. In the great majority of the history of armed confrontations between the GGs and the BGs, there doesn't exist a "draw-down". Ocassionally, yes, but rarely. One of the fastest men I ever saw drawing and shooting, used a single action revolver and had to actually cock the hammer on the way out of the holster, as was common with many shooting showmen of the recent past. He could toss a coin, draw and cock the hammer, fire hitting the coin and return the gun to the holster so fast it seemed impossible. It was because he was extremely talented, and he practised the same moves in the same manner for hours on end.

redfestiva · Post by **redfestiva** » August 1st, 2007, 12:51 am

I have factory springs and I carry with one in the tube, saftey off. My holster fully covers the trigger. The round hammer is pretty stiff, more so than a revolver which has no safety. As for accidently squeezing the trigger, I don't think so. It is hard enough in DA to pull that I need to use 2 fingers if I want to come close to hitting anything the size of a trash can lid. I have practised drawing from concealment by clearing the holster and pulling the hammer back as I raise the pistol for aim. For me the stiff hammer and hard DA pull is safety enough.

grayfox · Post by **grayfox** » August 2nd, 2007, 9:36 pm

I have four P-64s. Two was worked on by a very good gunsmith in this area & the trigger pull on DA is like an old S&W revolver. Never had a mag drop, never had a problem with any ammo. The other two are stock. I'd carry any of them at anytime. I think the secert is to shoot alot...and have faith in your self. If you blink, your dead.

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