9 Luger shot shells?

trzeci98 · Post by **trzeci98** » June 21st, 2007, 8:07 pm

I just got my p64 a couple of weeks back, I know I cannot use .380 or 9mm luger ammo. Luger especially, but could I use 9mm shot shells? I assume they wouldn't create too much pressure. what do you guys think of this? would it be safe to try at least?

dolang1 · Post by **dolang1** » June 21st, 2007, 9:07 pm

The 9mm luger shot shell should be 19mm long. That would be 1mm too long for the P-64. I'm assuming they are the same length as a regular bullet. I will buy some 9 mm shot shells this weekend and try to re load them. Some of you more advanced reloaders might want to step up to the plate and save me from myself again. I carry my 38 with one shot shell, and I'm interested in doing that for the P-64. Later Don

trzeci98 · Post by **trzeci98** » June 21st, 2007, 9:19 pm

I know it'd be too long, but it will chamber(safely)? so it would be a bad idea to shoot it from a 9x18? I like the shot shell for scare-off-non-lethal-first-shot-effect. plus I'm trying to expand ammo I can use, shot shells are fun in my 10/22, if only they'd cycle the action.

trent · Post by **trent** » June 21st, 2007, 10:53 pm

I imagine that if it did chamber properly It would not have enough power/ the length would not let the shell eject, and if It did it may not chamber the next round (this is all speculation though).
on non lethal rounds, one of our Polish compatriots said awhile back that the first two rounds in his pistol were rubber bullets, I believe that he carries a 9x19 but that would also be pretty cool in a 9x18 round (probably have to be flat nosed so it wouldn't penetrate

)

brigade · Post by **brigade** » June 21st, 2007, 10:56 pm

trzeci98... I know you are new to the P-64... but I honestly can't believe what I am reading. Please don't attempt to chamber the 9x19 for a gun that is machined and designed for the 9x18. I hope you don't get too offended but this seems so incredibly rediculous that I am waiting for the punch line. The 9x19 will stand off and not be seated all the way in like the 9x18.

barnett3006 · Post by **barnett3006** » June 21st, 2007, 11:22 pm

we had a similar discussion in another thread but I dont remember which one.

anyways, chambering a 9mm luger cartridge in a 9x18mm Mak chamber is NOT a good idea. The luger case is tapered ((the outside case diameter is smaller at the mouth of the case then at the head, the 9mm mak case is straight and should be the same diameter at both ends) I do not know the outside case diameters off hand) The extra 1mm in case length could potentially be shoved into the forcing cone in the barrel (upon the slide closing), which would crimp the case into the bullet or shot capsule and cause a dangerous overpressure -- even in with a light powder charge like what is in the 9mm shot shells. Also, the bullet diameter for a 9mm luger is .355" - .356", where as the 9mm Mak bullet diameter is .363" - .364", in other words, the 9x18mm bullet is bigger than the 9mm luger bullet. Those shot capsules rely on the rifling to cut the sides open so that it can open up and release the shot when the capsule leaves the muzzle. Firing a 9mm luger sized shot capsule down a makarov bore probably would not cut the plastic enough (if at all) to allow the capsule to breakup when it leaves the barrel. What you would end up with is a low velocity frangible bullet and the scare-off-nonlethal-first-shot you were looking for would be a WTF-you-shot-me-with-a-toy-gun-and-now-Im-gonna-shoot-you-first-shot.

There are a few exceptions to this rule but; Don't ever attempt to fire any cartridge that your gun was not specifically chambered for.

trent · Post by **trent** » June 22nd, 2007, 12:18 am

unless you have a m1895 nagant revolver ;D

barnett3006 · Post by **barnett3006** » June 22nd, 2007, 12:21 am

You shoot 32 S&W longs in that don't you?

Post by **normsutton** » June 22nd, 2007, 5:00 am

This is a 9 MM bullet put in a P-64 backwards

in most auto loaders the bullet head spaces on the mouth of the case this is one of the reason's always use the use the right ammo , and reloading auto loaders the case length is so important

NORM

donnerwetter58 · Post by **donnerwetter58** » June 22nd, 2007, 7:47 am

TTH,
I'm with you on this one. The answer should be obvious to any safe shooter.

trzeci98,
Send me your P-64 and go buy a shotgun before you hurt yourself or damage your gun.

This brings back memories of a guy I once saw shooting .357 mag. rounds from his Marlin 336 chambered in 30-30. Smoke and such came from the action with every shot. The cases were split clean down the side. But it worked for him and there was no telling him different.

To everyone else,
Safety should be first and foremost when it comes to firearms.
I'm sure 99.99% of you already know that. We just need to convince the other 0.01%.
Have a great weekend and shoot straight.
Dave

devlinfaust · Post by **devlinfaust** » June 22nd, 2007, 8:29 am

trzeci98,

Please on't feel bad about your question. I recall a good friend of mine insisting that if you a 9mm Mak that could shoot .380 with no problems. The truth is, it can shoot .380, but I wouldn't recommend it. My guess is that you could get tke 9mm shotshell to fire in your P-64, but there could be serious problems, including something bad happening to both the P-64 and you.

The other thing I would say, is that the shotshell is the last thing I'd personally use as a "first shot". Personally (and this only my personal observation) if the situation is grave enough to produce a weapon and fire it, you'd better be shoving something out the barrel that would actually stop the person and not just irritate him (or them). Consider that you might get this shoshell to work somehow, but your range is only going to be about 4 yards at best. If your first shot doesn't hit the person and/or stop him, then your pistol won't cycle and you'll essentially be helpless, facing an assailant that you've just fired on. Not a happy place to be.

I personally like shot-shells. To confess, I've had great sport with my Beretta 92fs shooting wood-boring bees with shotshells. Like you, I wish they'd cycle.

No question is a bad question. If you had a concern about this, you were smart to bring it up to these wise persons on this message board, who are far more knolwedeable than myself.

Enjoy your P-64!

trent · Post by **trent** » June 22nd, 2007, 9:29 am

You shoot 32 S&W longs in that don't you?

yea, but they are not particulary accurate, If you want to defend with it you can load it with .32 magnum (but I havent done that) needless to say I am still happy that there is more affordable nagant ammo out there now.

carguy · Post by **carguy** » June 22nd, 2007, 9:55 am

trezci98

If you want a non-lethal 1st shot...carry a rock in your pocket, throw it at you assailant and yell, "NOW THAT I HAVE YOUR ATTENTION, I HAVE A GUN AND AM GOING TO SHOOT YOU NEXT!!"

If placed properly, as with anything, that will have about the same effect as a 9mm shot shell.

If you want to shoot a 9mm shot shell buy a 9mm pistol. Otherwise find someone to reload a 9mm Mak shot shell for you.

Just be safe, we can't afford to have forum members getting hurt and having things bouncing off of their foreheads creating a THIRD EYES and such...

trzeci98 · Post by **trzeci98** » June 22nd, 2007, 7:55 pm

A simple "no" would suffice...

Post by **papabear** » June 22nd, 2007, 8:43 pm

Ok........."no".......... ;D

Welcome aboard, glad to have ya here.

Take Care,

papabear

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