CZ Model 52 at Auction Arms

Post by **normsutton** » May 21st, 2007, 1:15 pm

B
THANK YOU

NORM

anjdrifter · Post by **anjdrifter** » May 21st, 2007, 1:52 pm

here is my dollar 283 cents worth a link I found awhile ago about the mg ammo
www.alpharubicon.com/leo/cz52serger.htm

gunneyrabbit · Post by **gunneyrabbit** » May 21st, 2007, 6:54 pm

Bartos and every one else,
Thanks for the help, as soon as the ammo arrives I will get a picture on to the site. THANKS FOR THE HEADS UP GUYS, I would have shot the ammo thinking it was safe and not knowing for sure. Best thing to do is ask the fellow that had the auction, if it is SMG ammo it will be a very inexpensive lesson for me. In the future I need to do my home work before I invest.
I'll be in touch, Thanks Again To Every One............... G.R.

Post by **normsutton** » May 21st, 2007, 7:11 pm

G.R.
do you reload if you do and the ammo turns out un safe , you could always pull the bullets and dump the powder out and add new powder and reload them , that's what I do with 7.62 x 39 blanks
and add my own powder, bullets

NORM

gunneyrabbit · Post by **gunneyrabbit** » May 22nd, 2007, 3:50 pm

Norm,
No I don't reload but I'm about to learn. One of my friends does and that was his suggestion also. He says if I buy the powder and dies he'll get me started. I spoke to Hal the fellow who sold the item at the auction site, he said that he had never shot any of the ammo through a hand gun but that it did cycle his VZ SMG. Well now I guess that answers that question doesn't it, no foul there, like I said yesterday; shame on me for not doing my home work. Actually I'm looking foreword to getting started on the reloading, it is something I have been wanting to do and never got around to. Got so far as down loading the Lee Loader CD on to my computer at one time, now I guess I'll finally be able to put it to work.
Thanks for all the good advise to everyone who replied:D
G.R.

gunneyrabbit · Post by **gunneyrabbit** » May 22nd, 2007, 3:57 pm

Norm,
No I don't reload but I'm about to learn. One of my friends does and that was his suggestion also. He says if I buy the powder and dies he'll get me started. I spoke to Hal the fellow who sold the item at the auction site, he said that he had never shot any of the ammo through a hand gun but that it did cycle his VZ SMG. Well now I guess that answers that question doesn't it, no foul there, like I said yesterday; shame on me for not doing my home work. Actually I'm looking foreword to getting started on the reloading, it is something I have been wanting to do and never got around to. Got so far as down loading the Lee Loader CD on to my computer at one time, now I guess I'll finally be able to put it to work.
Thanks to every one for all the good advise

G.R

Post by **normsutton** » May 22nd, 2007, 4:56 pm

G.R
it sound's like everything is going great got a new gun and a new hobby all in one shot
we on this board can answer reloading question too , someone can all ways come up with an answer
best of luck
NORM

dana · Post by **dana** » May 25th, 2007, 10:49 pm

I am new to this sight but I have to disagree with most of you guys. The Cz52 was made to shoot the machinegun ammo. This is why it uses a roller locking system similar to the some HK rifles. Most of the machinegun ammo is perfectly safe and fun to shoot in the gun, it was made for this. But there is some batches that have caused catastrophic failures in the CZ. One of the web pages a few years ago had the head stamps of the bad stuff posted. I think it was Makarov.com that had a CZ52 section with this in FAQ. I am not disagreeing that some caution should be used, I just want to clarify that the CZ52 was made to shoot the subgun ammo. It is a much stronger gun than the other guns that chamber similar cartridges. I think it is Makarov.com that has a lot of CZ52 stuff on there page. Check it out.

gunneyrabbit · Post by **gunneyrabbit** » May 31st, 2007, 10:55 pm

anjdrifter and dana,
Thank you so much for the information, I thought I might have bought a pig in a polk until I read your postings and the information at the web site. I will post a picture of the ammo and box at the forum as soon as it arrives in the hope that bartos can give me a little more information, feeling much better about my purchase.
Thank you both again................ G.R.

anjdrifter · Post by **anjdrifter** » June 1st, 2007, 6:08 am

gunney you are welcome that is why we love this place ....isnt to help feed information and experiences...plus camaraderie ,friendship ,and just plain old good time...
al

carguy · Post by **carguy** » June 1st, 2007, 9:51 am

Yeah, yeah...enough already.

Gunny, we can only be polite for so long...where's the pictures!!

Stop teasing by talking and start SHOWING! 8~)

pshootr · Post by **pshootr** » June 1st, 2007, 11:08 am

There used to be a guy on the 'net who's hobby was blowing up guns, progressively overloading cases with more and more powder until he encountered a catastrophic failure, that is. As I recall, he tested both the CZ-52 pistol and the Tokarev, and found that the CZ-52's chamber would split with as little as a 25% overload, while the Tokarev would safely handle much more pressure. Failure of the locking system will not cause a catastrophic failure, but failure of the chamber to contain the pressure will. IIRC, a number of years ago a gentleman in Norway was killed when the shooter in the next lane suffered such a failure with a CZ-52 and the extractor was blown out of the slide and penetrated the skull of the man next to him. Will try to find references.

THR thread on CZ-52 vs. Tokarev here: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=22071

Here's an excerpt from that thread: "There's controversy as to which gun is actually stronger. Check out the military handguns board on gunboards.com (where the serious milsurp guys hang out). . . a gent over there has posted that he's done a lot of experimenting and found that the CZ's action may be stronger, but the CZ-52's bbl blows before this comes into play and before the Tok blows."

OK, I found a post by "Clark", the guy I was thinking of, in the same thread as referenced above,

"The CZ52 blows up at less than the 65kspi that it takes to make the primer fall out of a rimless brass case. No other pistol I am aware of that takes rimless cases is that weak.

I need to do no more CZ52 tests to convince myself.
The CZ52 is the weakest semi auto pistol I have tested.

The 25 acp pistols I have tested are stronger.
The 32 acp pistols I have tested are stronger.
The 380 pistols I have tested are stronger.
The 9x19mm pistols I have tested are stronger.
The 9x23mm pistols I have tested are stronger.
The 40 S&W pistols I have tested are stronger.
The one 10 mm pistol I have tested is stronger.
The 45 acp pistols I have tested are stronger.
The other 7.62x25mm pistols [Tokarevs] are stronger."

Another "Clark" quote: "With the CZ52s I have blown up, the operator was not hurt [me], but anyone standing to the right could get an extractor through the head. Of course even with a strong gun, like a Tokarev, a blown case head can send pieces of the extractor to the right at lethal speeds."

bartos061 · Post by **bartos061** » June 1st, 2007, 12:36 pm

Hi, I checked my materials and:
Like I said there are two types of Czech ammo - for smg and for pistols.
There is only one way to recognize them without box.
You must cut one bullet, if you find inside steel core this is smg ammo. When there is lead only, you have pistol ammo.

However there is no danger to shoot with smg ammo!

Also I found info that CZ-52 is one of the weakest pistol in the world.
It is very probably that after 1500 shots pistol can crack - see photo:

After it you can shoot with your pistol about 1500 more shots.
Of course when you use smg ammo - life of the pistol will be shorter.
And if you use barrel for 9mm you will be happier with your pistol much longer.

What is more if your pistol has VOZ markings on the right side of pistol - it means that pistol was used in the army and was renovated(a lot of shots

).

B.

pshootr · Post by **pshootr** » June 1st, 2007, 10:13 pm

All told, that doesn't look like a very disabling crack. I would think that it would be self-limited by the slide stop cutout directly below it.

gunneyrabbit · Post by **gunneyrabbit** » June 2nd, 2007, 5:55 pm

Pistol and ammo arrived today and she is a beauty, I cut one of the bullets as Bartos suggested and it is defiantly a steel core bullet, I guess that puts that question to rest. Bartos, I looked every where on the pistol and no VOZ to be seen, thanks for the info. It is interesting that the pistol is able to shoot the jacked up SMG loads, I still think that I will stick with the slower pistol ammo from Sellier and Bellot and the reduced power reloads. Also, I think I will buy a new 9mm barrel and get a extractor from one of the supply houses. If the pistol is as weak as indicated there should be plenty of parts around. Does any one know where the 9mm barrels can be ordered from?
G.R.

P.S.
I will send photos just as soon as my wife shows me how. :-[

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