Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

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wlockridge
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Re: Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

Post by wlockridge »

Drunkenjack, welcome to the forum. In my 64 I use the 22# recoil spring and the 18# trigger spring because I shoot hot loads. Some of the resistance of the slide being racked, and I emphasize SOME, can be helped by putting a drop of two of LUCAS assembly oil in the slide rails prior to reassembly and checking to see that there are no nicks or burrs on the rails, sometimes they can be very small. LUCAS has moly, zink, and other high pressure additives that, if used over a short period of time can make the mating surfaces extremely slick. Use judiciously, a little goes a long way. Also as was mentioned by snailman above, make sure the recoil spring is installed with the small end towards the frame. I would take that a step farther and say, if someone has already put the 22# recoil spring in it, be sure the faces of the coils on the ends are ground flat, it DOES make a difference (something I learned from this board). As far as racking it, my 5' (standing on a book ) wife who goes all of a 110 soaking wet has no problem racking mine, she just puts the safety on safe, grips it with her right hand using the safety lever for something to help her not slip as she's pulling the slide back and gives it a good fast pull. No issues. The thing that concerns me is your safety issue. Either you have a broken spring or some bubba has cut loose on the safety cams with a file in which case you're going to need some new parts. As it is the weapon is not safe to carry Suppose she misses the first two shots, if the safety is in the down position when the slide goes back the hammer will NOT be cocked which means she'll have to deal with both the safety and cocking the weapon or dealing with the trigger pull. If you fool around with cutting the hammer spring, or any other springs for that matter, you're asking for disaster. 18# on the trigger is the best you are going to get anything less you not only risk a "hair trigger" but also light strikes where the firing pin doesn't contact the primer with enough force to ignite it. Once you have the safety issue fixed (which contrary to popular belief was SUPPOSED to be stiff) you can work on racking the slide. Once that is mastered she needs to practice thumbing off the safety and cocking the hammer as she's pulling the weapon from the holster. Having carried a revolver for 20 plus years on the PD it was a natural thing for me to cock the hammer as I drew but it took a little bit of practice to thumb the safety off as well. The trick is to use the inside knuckle of your thumb to push IN and up at the same time. Using this method makes it smooth as silk. The stiff trigger pull is just and idiosyncrasy of this particular weapon and only so much can be done about it. It's a great piece of engineering and craftsmanship but every weapon has it's flaws. It's just a matter of whether
or not you can adapt to them. Good luck and again, welcome.
Shoot first, Shoot straight, and hit what you're aiming at, if you can do these things and have six rounds of ammo, you'll have two thirds more than you need to prevail.
the_flatland
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Re: Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

Post by the_flatland »

First, I love my P64, and it is my carry. It also does not exhibit any of the symptoms you describe with yours. I did resolve much of the recoil by changing to a set of Marschal grips. They are a bit thicker by the webbing between the thumb and index finger, removing much of the felt recoil. They're also slightly thicker than the plastic grip, making it just a bit more comfortable as well. My 22lb spring just arrived, and haven't fired it with the new spring yet.

I second the motion from weasel that you look for a different carry. If your wife cannot operate all facets of the firearm quickly and easily, it very well could be a death sentence should she need it. If she really wants to carry this gun, I'd recommend moving to a lighter spring. Sure, it would increase recoil, but this is for a gun that you fire a couple of clips in every couple of months just to keep yourself familiar with the gun. Get yourself the recoil spring pack and the hammer spring pack. Mix and match until you find a combination that she can rack and is comfortable enough with that she feels safe handling the weapon.

Of course, fix the safety first! The gun is a paperweight if it cannot cycle and cycle reliably - as in 1-200 rounds in a single session without error. Mine does, with both FMJ and my JHP.

Regarding the safety, remember this gun was developed with military applications in mind. There is no drop safety. The safety does put a block on both sides of the firing pin which intercepts the hammer so the pin is not struck during decocking. The safety is the decocker, so if the safety is engaged, the hammer will not travel if the trigger is pulled.

Regarding how the gun is loaded while you carry, this is related to your wife's comfort level with the firearm. I carry a round chambered and safety off. The DA trigger is so stiff that I feel comfortable using it as a form of safety. To me it is just as effective (if not more so) than the DA safety on a P380 or the trigger safety on a Glock. If carrying this way, you should practice pulling the firearm from its concealed location, with a DA fire followed with a SA follow up.

There's my two cents!
snailman153624
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Re: Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

Post by snailman153624 »

the_flatland wrote:First, I love my P64, and it is my carry. It also does not exhibit any of the symptoms you describe with yours. I did resolve much of the recoil by changing to a set of Marschal grips. They are a bit thicker by the webbing between the thumb and index finger, removing much of the felt recoil. They're also slightly thicker than the plastic grip, making it just a bit more comfortable as well. My 22lb spring just arrived, and haven't fired it with the new spring yet.

I second the motion from weasel that you look for a different carry. If your wife cannot operate all facets of the firearm quickly and easily, it very well could be a death sentence should she need it. If she really wants to carry this gun, I'd recommend moving to a lighter spring. Sure, it would increase recoil, but this is for a gun that you fire a couple of clips in every couple of months just to keep yourself familiar with the gun. Get yourself the recoil spring pack and the hammer spring pack. Mix and match until you find a combination that she can rack and is comfortable enough with that she feels safe handling the weapon.

Of course, fix the safety first! The gun is a paperweight if it cannot cycle and cycle reliably - as in 1-200 rounds in a single session without error. Mine does, with both FMJ and my JHP.

Regarding the safety, remember this gun was developed with military applications in mind. There is no drop safety. The safety does put a block on both sides of the firing pin which intercepts the hammer so the pin is not struck during decocking. The safety is the decocker, so if the safety is engaged, the hammer will not travel if the trigger is pulled.

Regarding how the gun is loaded while you carry, this is related to your wife's comfort level with the firearm. I carry a round chambered and safety off. The DA trigger is so stiff that I feel comfortable using it as a form of safety. To me it is just as effective (if not more so) than the DA safety on a P380 or the trigger safety on a Glock. If carrying this way, you should practice pulling the firearm from its concealed location, with a DA fire followed with a SA follow up.

There's my two cents!
I hope you never accidentally snag the hammer or drop your p64, because as you mentioned, there is nothing stopping the firing pin from moving with the safety off. There was even a poster on here a while back who had an accidental discharge carrying like you, and no, he didn't pull the trigger.
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Curly1
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Re: Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

Post by Curly1 »

+1 I agree with using the safety.
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Weasel640
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Re: Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

Post by Weasel640 »

snailman153624 wrote:I hope you never accidentally snag the hammer or drop your p64, because as you mentioned, there is nothing stopping the firing pin from moving with the safety off. There was even a poster on here a while back who had an accidental discharge carrying like you, and no, he didn't pull the trigger.
OK I was staying away from this. In fact on this one, I agree with you and Curly. SHE should use the safety as a safety.

As far as anyone else, this is a discussion that we have had many times before. Just be aware of the condition of your P-64. If you choose to use the safety as a decocker only, know that the hammer can catch on something and release onto the firing pin. It has happened before: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4378 It can happen again if care is not taken.

We already know there are two trains of thought on the carry condition. We have had this argument. If we want to start it again lets not interrupt the original discussion and someone start a new thread. Last thing I'll link:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1698&p=48627#p48627
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biggunner
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Re: Problems wit a P64...1917...pink and black

Post by biggunner »

I believe the safety detent spring and the safety detent itself is probably missing which is causing your safety to flop around . I lost my detent spring and detent for a bit and it acted as you described when I put it together without it.
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