I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

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Tinkerer
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I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by Tinkerer » January 19th, 2011, 10:25 am

I am typing with one hand because the other one is in a sling. Yesterday while putting my
P64 in the safe, I dropped it and bang...I was shot through and through my left forearm. I usually carry my P64 with a round chambered, hammer down, and safety off. I like this setup because I'm one DA pull away from defending myself. The reason I was putting it away was because I had to work on a military base and couldn't carry it with me for the afternoon. I was very fortunate, the Hornady XTP missed all bones, major blood vessels and other such important stuff. I'm writing this somewhat embarrassing message in hopes of preventing someone else from the same fate. With the safety off the hammer has a little movement and I can only assume that the pistol landed right on the hammer. This small amount of movement must have been enough to bounce the firing pin forward. When I've recovered a bit more I'm going to see if the safety would have prevented this. I like the P64, but don't want to carry it if I can't have a round chambered.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by surfzombie » January 19th, 2011, 11:58 am

Man, I'm sorry that happened to you. I also am glad you posted this because that has been one of my concerns with this pistol. If memory serves me correctly I have even ask a similar question of "Would the gun go off if dropped while in the position?" Many have stated no it would not and you just proved it would. I think that I will carry it with one it the chamber and the safety on. I will practice my draw and flipping the safety off drill and see how that goes. Good luck with your recovery.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by electross » January 19th, 2011, 12:40 pm

GEEEEEEZ, Your lucky it was only the arm. Thanks for posting and don't be embarrassed. Hope you begin to feel better as soon as possible. If that hollow point had hit bone that would have been a very bad thing for your arm. Just can't believe how lucky you are. Take care of yourself and heal quick.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by GrailKnight » January 19th, 2011, 4:06 pm

Tinkerer wrote: I usually carry my P64 with a round chambered, hammer down, and safety off.
Most importantly I am happy to hear you are okay. I do not know you but that matters not to me.

None of this is a criticism of you just curious about some things.

1. Why you would think that with the safety off that the P64 could not fire if dropped?

2. If I understand correctly the P-64 the safety is two parts. One is the trigger pull at 30lbs and the main being the safety w/ trigger bar block.

3. If the safety is off with a round in the chamber as you carry it a sharp blow the hammer from dropping or striking it is more than enough force to move the firing pin forward enough to strike the primer.

I was taught years ago to assume that if a live round is in the chamber and the safety is off that a blow to the hammer can be enough to push the firing pin into the primer and cause ignition and then firing of the round.

** If someone disagrees with any of the above please let me know why and the basis of fact or learned from experience.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by mychoads » January 19th, 2011, 4:17 pm

Sorry to hear about your accident, glad it wasn't worse.

I thought the P-64 had a automatic safety built into the sear that won't let the hammer move forward without the trigger being pulled. Your story got me thinking, so I just checked my P-64 and my hammer will not move forward unless the trigger is being held down. I wonder if there is a problem with your gun. I have dropped my P-64 a short distance, not directly on the hammer, but with a round chambered and safety off, and it never fired. Any mechanical safety device can fail, but I would imagine it would take one hell of a drop to hit the primer hard enough to fire.

Hope you make a quick recovery.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by normsutton » January 19th, 2011, 9:11 pm

what did the Southern Pines N.C. police have to say about it , you did go to the hospital didn't you and all hospitals have to report a gun shot wound , and most polices departments confiscate the firearm until the investigation is over, you are lucky to get it back so soon

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Tinkerer
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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by Tinkerer » January 19th, 2011, 11:17 pm

Thanks to all for the well wishes and constructive criticism. I read in other threads that others were carrying their P64s in the same way I was and I didn't want to hear that someone else had been hurt. My pistol has less than 200 rounds through it since I bought it. It was packaged in shrink-wrap and had no signs of being fired. I believe it was either unissued or newly re-arsenaled. It is very tight and very well made. I don't think the pistol is at fault. I have no defense for assuming that the pistol would be safe in the condition I was carrying it. I will be conducting tests on all of my guns to be sure I know EXACTLY how they can be expected to operate. My assumption could have gotten someone else hurt or worse. I'm thankful it was me that took the hit and that it was a minor wound as gunshots go. I was questioned by the local PD at the emergency room, but so far have not heard any more from them. No confiscation yet. (BTW, I do not live in Southern Pines, NC.)

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by dfunk » January 20th, 2011, 12:13 am

Glad you're okay and that no one else was hurt.

I'm one that used to carry my P64 with a round chambered, safety off. I'd do the same if I carried the gun again. I'd be very interested to hear what the diagnosis is of the gun after an investigation and to see photos of your wound. Did the gun drop on a concrete surface? Does your hammer have free forward movement when it's at rest?

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by DoubleTap » January 20th, 2011, 12:21 am

Glad to hear that nothing major was hit, although I'm guessing you'll be sore for a while. You're to be commended for sharing your story, in the hopes that no one else will have to suffer what you have, or worse.

My thought is this: even though the hammer may not move, will the firing pin still move with the safety disengaged? This is a military firearm, designed to work with military hardball with hard primers. The designers may not have worried too much about the firing pin itself, seeing as how they never anticipated this pistol being used with civilian ammunition. They probably figured (correctly) that the inertia of the firing pin alone wouldn't be sufficient to set off a hard primer, even if the pistol was dropped pretty hard. That might not be the case when loaded with civilian fodder. If that it so, then the P-64 certainly wouldn't be the first military firearm to have this issue.

I'm just throwing this out there as a possibility. I don't know if the gun has a passive firing pin block or not. Perhaps someone else does?

Tinkerer
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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by Tinkerer » January 20th, 2011, 7:21 am

The floor was a typical carpet over subfloor over crawlspace. One detail I have left out is that I have installed the lighter mainspring to reduce the DA trigger pull. This may be crucial. As I mentioned before, with the safety off and the hammer down there is a small, probably 1/16", of movement in the hammer. It is not free play but the hammer is held off the back of the slide this small amount by what may be the firing pin return spring. I have not yet checked to see if this movement would be there with the original mainspring. It's hard to do much investigating with one hand. :? Pictures attached from yesterday at the doctor's office getting the dressing changed ~24 hrs after the shot. You can see where the expanded hollowpoint raked a path up my arm after exiting the muscle.
P64_Entry.jpg
P64_Exit.jpg

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by DoubleTap » January 20th, 2011, 7:43 am

That hurts just looking at it! :shock:

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by electross » January 20th, 2011, 9:08 am

I checked my P64 last night and it would seem there is an obstruction blocking movement of the hammer when the hammer is in the de-cocked position. With the trigger pulled after a dry fire and maintaining the trigger in the most rear position the hammer then has movement forward and can strike the firing pin. Don't know if this holds up to dropping on the hammer and quite frankly I am not going to try it. But, I do think looking at your photo's of your arm and my desire not to duplicate that on my arm, I am going to play with the P64 and see if I can tell how that happened. My Walther was recalled for a possibility of the gun firing when using the hammer drop and for the life of me I could not see how it could happen but Smith and Wesson repaired it and so I want to check the P64 out thoughly. Heal fast friend.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by MakAttack » January 20th, 2011, 3:45 pm

Thanks for sharing, good lesson for all. Sorry to hear you're hurt- you have much to be thankful for!

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by gunneyrabbit » January 21st, 2011, 1:45 am

Plus one with MakAttack and every one else!
I tried several times to duplicate your mishap, I went as far as smacking the cocked hammer with a one inch dowel and framing hammer with no results? It makes me wonder if there is an issue with the individual pistol that you purchased?
I would suggest that you have the item examined by a gun smith that is familier with the P64 to see if any modification has been attempted by a neophyte gun smith.
G,R.

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Re: I got shot by my P64 yesterday...

Post by normsutton » January 21st, 2011, 6:23 am

GR
I'll redirect you to my post ,
normsutton wrote:what did the Southern Pines N.C. police have to say about it , you did go to the hospital didn't you and all hospitals have to report a gun shot wound , and most polices departments confiscate the firearm until the investigation is over, you are lucky to get it back so soon

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